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Posts Tagged ‘freedom’

March 13 – Gen. 3:24; “So he drove out the man; and he placed at the east of the garden of Eden Cherubim’s, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to keep the way of the tree of life”. 

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Next to John 3:16, the Genesis scripture should be at the forefront of every believer’s mind.  Man was separated from God, thus the need for John 3:16.  It was not God’s intention for this to happen.  He knew it would happen, but it doesn’t mean that He willed it to happen.  The Mormon believes man had to sin in order to know joy, sadness and to even procreate.  They believe this sin commandment came from God.

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“In conformity to the will of the Lord, Adam fell both spiritually and temporally.”  Mormon Doctrine, pg. 268.

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March 12 – John 16:17; “Even the Spirit of Truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you”.

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Please show the Mormon the truth about the Holy Spirit.  He actually dwells inside of the believer!

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“Now what is this other Comforter?  It is no more nor less than the Lord Jesus Christ Himself…that when any man obtains this last Comforter, he will have the personage of Jesus Christ to attend him, or appear unto him from time to time…”  Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pg. 151.

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February 27 – “Neither is salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.”  Acts 4:12

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AMEN!  We must ask the Mormon what the phrase “none other name” means to them.

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“Some have said that I was very presumptuous to say that Brother Brigham was my God and Saviour, Brother Joseph was his God and the one that gave Joseph the keys of the kingdom was his God which was Peter.  Jesus Christ was his God and (the) Father of Jesus Christ was Adam.”  Journal of Wilford Woodruff, April 10, 1852.

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February 26 – “Neither give heed to fables or endless genealogies, which minister questions, rather than godly edifying which is in faith: so do.”  1 Tim. 1:4.

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Ask the Mormon if Joseph Smith had absolute proof that he truly was related to Jesus Christ then what good does it do him?  What purpose does it serve to even mention something like this?  Would it mean that he had a ticket to heaven because of it?

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D&C 113:5-6; “What is the root of Jesse spoken of in the 10th verse of the 11th chapter (Isaiah).  Behold, thus saith the Lord, it is a descendant of Jesse, as well as of Joseph, unto whom rightly belongs the priesthood, and the keys of the kingdom, for an ensign, and for the gathering of my people in the last days”.

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February 25 – “Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God;  And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even death of the cross.”  Phil. 2:5-6, 8.

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There are actually two subjects to notice with this verse.  Explain the word “robbery” to the Mormon.  In the Greek, it means “grasped”.  The other subject is the belief that Jesus had to perform, or work, to receive His salvation.

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“If a man gets a fullness of the priesthood of God he has to get it in the same way that Jesus Christ obtained it, and that was by keeping all the commandments and obeying all the ordinances of the house of the Lord.”  Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pg. 308

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February 23 – Galatians 1:8 says; “But if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed”.

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Seems evident from this verse that there are no other gospels or testimonies from anyone no matter what they say!  The front of the Book of Mormon now says that it is “Another Testament of Jesus Christ”.  Ask your Mormon friend what his thoughts are about this predicament.

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 Joseph Smith said; “Take away the Book of Mormon and the revelations, and where is our religion?  We have none”.   Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pg. 71.  In other words, there is nothing inside of this religion that has anything to do with Jesus Christ.

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February 21 – God warns us about false prophets in Deut. 13:6-9; “If thy brother, the son of they mother, or thy son, or thy daughter, or the wife of thy bosom, or thy friend which is as thine own soul, entice thee secretly, saying, Let us go and serve other gods, which thou has no known, thou, nor thy father; Namely, of the gods of the people which are round about you, nigh unto thee, or far off from thee, from the one end of the earth even unto the other end of the earth; Thou shalt not consent unto him, nor hearken unto him; neither shall thine eye pity him, neither shalt thou spare, neither shalt thou conceal him: But thou shalt surely kill him…”

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It seems clear how serious God was in regards to false prophets.  He wanted none of them to survive, and He certainly didn’t want us to pity them.  We are told not to listen at all to them.

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Joseph Smith seemed to believe that he could slip out of his self-proclaimed prophet-hood anytime he chose to do so.  Is this reasonable considering all we’ve learned just this year?  He is quoted in Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith as follows; “…I told them that a prophet was a prophet only when he was acting as such”.  History of the Church 5:265

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February 18 – God dresses us through Christ Jesus in the garments of salvation as He spoke of in Isaiah 61:10; “I will greatly rejoice in the LORD, my soul shall be joyful in my God; for he hath clothed me with the garments of salvation, he hath covered me with the robe of righteousness, as a bridegroom decketh himself with ornaments, and as a bride adorneth herself with her jewels”.

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Under the Mormon’s street clothing” are their temple garments.  These garments are to be worn at all times.  They have markings on each breast and groin area for both male and female.  Mormons see them as a sign of protection from God and to be set apart from the rest of the world.  They use Rev. 16:15 as a reference to their need of being clothed with them. 

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“The garment represents sacred covenants.  It fosters modesty and becomes a shield and protection to the wearer.”  Preparing to Enter the Holy Temple, pg. 21.

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February 17 – Hebrews 1:5 is clear about what God said in relation to angels and Jesus Christ.  “For unto which of the angels said he at any time, THOU ART MY SON, THIS DAY HAVE I BEGOTTEN THEE?  And again, I WILL BE TO HIM A FATHER, AND HE SHALL BE TO ME A SON?”

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Mormons believe that Jesus and Lucifer are literally spiritually begotten by God and the Heavenly Mother.  Ask them what they think about this verse.

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“The contention in heaven was-Jesus said there would be certain souls that would not be saved; and the devil said he could save them all, and laid his plans before the grand council, who gave their vote in favor of Jesus Christ.  So the devil rose up in rebellion against God, and was cast down, with all who put up their heads for him”.  Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pg. 357.

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February 16 – 1 Corinthians 15:47; “The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven”.

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Mormons will tell you there aren’t any scriptures that say we don’t have a heavenly mother, yet it’s clear that God is self-existent without the need of anyone’s help for creating us.  In fact, He’s the only one to come down from heaven at all, meaning we were not with Him before living on this earth.  Ask the Mormon why they believe there is a “Heavenly Mother”.

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“This doctrine that there is a Mother in Heaven was affirmed in plainness by the First Presidency of the Church…that man is the “offspring of celestial parentage” and that “all men and women are in the similitude of the universal Father and Mother, and are literally the sons and daughters of Deity””.  Mormon Doctrine pg. 516, Bruce McConkie.

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February 4 – John 1:1, 14; “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.  And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth”. 

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It’s always important to pay close attention to the wording of contracts, bosses, parents or anything else that is in authority in your life.  You may miss a key element that could cost you millions of dollars, cost you your freedom or ultimately your own salvation.

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Joseph Smith’s ‘New Translation’ of the Bible says in John 1:1, 14; “In the beginning was the gospel preached through the Son.  And the gospel was the word, and the word was with the Son, and the Son was with God, and the Son was of God.  And the same word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the Only Begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth”.

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February 3 – We find salvation in no one else but through our Lord Jesus Christ.  Acts 4:12 says; “Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved”. 

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For the Mormon there is a list of people holding the keys of salvation.  At the top of this list is their heavenly father, then Jesus, then Adam, Joseph Smith and next in line is the living prophet.  If you happen to be a woman in the church you will also have your husband to answer to.

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“The President of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints holds the keys of salvation for all men now living because he is the only one by whose authorization the sealing power of the priesthood can be used to seal men up to salvation and exaltation in the kingdom of God. (D&C 132:7).”

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THE GREAT DEBATES

October 1988

October 2006

 

     Late October 1988, Las Vegas, Nevada.  It was there, that a small group of people stood over a hole in the ground, watching as the tiny white casket which held its precious cargo was lowered into its final resting place.  The casket held a child of God that was serving a mission for the Lord and from the results of her funeral; many would come to know the saving power of Christ Jesus, His crucifixion and resurrection.

     Of course the baby’s parents felt as bad as they looked on that cold autumn morning and the baby’s grandparents, a couple of uncles and a cousin stood by to support her grief-stricken  mom and dad.  Nothing anyone could say would make it better as far as her mom was concerned and as the sound of the bishop’s voice droned on, the thoughts of the childless new mother was not at her daughter’s graveside. 

                Within the first five minutes of the eulogy that cold morning Mallory’s mom frantically searched her memory bank of the Jesus she had heard about in her travels over the past six years.  What very little she did know wasn’t even close to what that bishop was proclaiming. 

     At the end of the graveside service the wind picked up as everyone walked back to their vehicles and the heartbroken mom turned to catch one more glimpse of her baby’s casket.  The mom and dad drove home in stunned silence for most of the twenty minute drive back to the apartment.  Little things were spoken between the two; “she sure had a lot of black curly hair” and “her nose looked just like…”  What was there to be said?  There was no baby, no help, no hope, no God to reach to and find comfort.  The only thing she left that graveyard with was the bishop’s voice telling her that she would never see her baby again because they hadn’t been married in the temple.  God would give Mallory to another family who was worthy of her.  That’s when the visual made its appearance and the bishop’s voice began to serve as noise in the background. 

     When he said the words “she’ll be given to another couple who is worthy of her because they have been married in the temple…” her mind instantly pictured a massive white building with little to no windows; the temple.  On the other side of the picture there stood a cross with blood that had been dripping from its owner that made the dust that caught the blood Holy ground. 

     Back at the apartment the young woman walked in her little home to be greeted by her own mother.  As they changed clothes and began making lunch the debate that had been at the tips of everyone’s tongues broke loose.

     The younger mom said to the older mom; “…didn’t you hear what that guy said?  He told me that I was going to hell!”  The older mom shook her head and made a clicking noise with her tongue as she told her daughter that she had misunderstood the bishop.  The young, defiant woman knew differently; yet sadly enough neither she nor her husband even discussed the funeral until four years later.  However, for now the bishop’s quote of the Prophet Joseph Fielding Smith rang in her ears; “If parents are righteous, they will have their children after the resurrection. Little children who die, whose parents are not worthy of an exaltation, will be adopted into the families of those who are worthy.”

     How was that to be misunderstood?  It seemed rather dry and pretty straightforward to her.  She wanted God, but didn’t know how to go about “getting” Him as she was too intimidated to visit another church.  She also didn’t know that the Holy, Merciful God of the Bible, the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob would bless the couple with two more daughters within the next four years and the greatest gift of all; their salvation! 

     I never could have imagined that eighteen years later I would be praising a righteous Sovereign God for the gift of Mallory Elizabeth Grim and be involved in yet another debate.  This time it would be in a Seattle Christian radio station with my husband and of course who else, but a couple of Mormons?!

     The debate in that apartment has now lasted 18 years.  I’ve never counted how many times I’ve “debated” with my mother about that day so long ago.  She is just as convinced today that I misunderstood and I’m even more convinced I heard them correctly.  The divide is wide indeed, but Jesus warned us of these days.  He said there would be mothers against daughters and sons against fathers on account of His name. 

     It is almost surreal for me as I look back on that day in Vegas and think of what God has done for my family and for me too.  I never would have imagined that this is what I would be doing; yet now I cannot imagine not doing this work!  The debate at KGNW last week with Thor Tolo has blessed us beyond measure.  We can’t thank everyone enough for their prayers that went up for the event!  I’ve had people pray for me before when I speak or do a radio show, but in all honesty I have never experienced what I did this last week and the week prior to the taping of the show!  It was very obvious to those in the studio and to Kirk and me that God was present among us!

    I noticed the “misunderstandings” and topics between the debate last week and the debate 18 years ago were very similar.  They both contained the following subjects:  absence of the cross, no assurance of salvation and good works.  The most striking similarity was the emptiness in my heart while I wondered why; both then and now.  Why is it they won’t even stop to give it (the truth) the slightest of consideration?  What bad thing could it bring upon you to just consider the possibility that there may be some truth in what we (non-Mormons; Christians) proclaim?

     Mallory wasn’t the only “thing” I buried that day in 1988.  Before I got up from my chair at that gravesite I recall looking down into the grave and picturing myself placing my heritage down there as well.  I knew on that day my ignorant, misinformed perception of “my people” was over and done with. 

     One of the first things Thor asked me at the debate was to explain why I believe the Mormons are not Christians.  I told him the main reason is because of the cross.  In Mormonism there is no cross in the sense of it being the altar of God.  Once again, it’s about the cross, or rather the lack thereof.  The sign of the empty cross doesn’t just imply, but shouts out the good news of our salvation and resurrection!  On the flip side you see the Mormon parents at their child’s funeral.  All that is offered is the hope of going to the temple a year later to work for salvation of the child and the parent; no mention of a cross in that scenario.

     When Thor asked Stake President Burnham if he had assurance of his salvation, he replied; “Well now you’re testing my humility”.  Oh please.   I knew he wouldn’t be able to proclaim any good news of rest for his own soul, assurance that the Shepherd is always with him to lead, console and keep watch over His flock.  There is no hope when you are working all the time for your own life.  How are you rejuvenated, fed, rested and refreshed?  You can’t be if you are the one that is always in control.  It took me years to disencumber myself of the filthy robe of self-sufficiency.  I felt much like what the apostle Paul described in Romans chapter seven; “why do I do the things I don’t want to do but don’t do the things I want to do”?  The only way my life got into order is when I got off the merry-go-round of doing good works for my salvation.  Even to this day, how could I be sure if it (salvation) was based on my own worthiness?  This week and last week I’ve worked pretty hard.  Next week I might get distracted or maybe take it easy.  How do I justify myself in God’s eyes with this type of spiritual battle going on inside my soul?

     As mentioned earlier, we have been so blessed by seeing God at work in people’s lives.  It’s been nothing short of an honor to watch His grace flow to those around us!  We’re sending out this praise and prayer report so you can be blessed as well!  Continue to pray won’t you that those who are struggling with their decision to either join or leave the Church would be made through the will of the true God of the Bible?  And pray for us as we help the people in their decisions so that we would only be focused on Him and our reasons for doing this!

     Mr. Burnham e-mailed Kirk and me a couple of days after the debate to let us know that he had researched our claim about the false prophecy of Oliver Granger.  We’ll be posting that on the site this week.  He wanted us to be sure to let everyone know that indeed the prophecy did come true.  He (Burnham) found some letters that were written by Granger’s descendants describing their grandfather and what he had done for the Church.  As we stated on the show, it didn’t come to pass.  This brings us to a little project.  We’re asking everyone to let us know; have you ever heard of Oliver Granger?  We’ll be posting our findings on the site at the end of the month!

              You can download and listen to the debate by clicking on the links below. Each file is approximately 9 MB.  These take you to the website of KGNW and the Live From Seattle Show.

Hour 1:

http://boss.streamos.com/download/swn/miscellaneous/kgnw/lfs_special_hour_1.mp3

Hour 2: http://boss.streamos.com/download/swn/miscellaneous/kgnw/lfs_special_hour_2.mp3

Hour 3: http://boss.streamos.com/download/swn/miscellaneous/kgnw/lfs_special_hour_3.mp3

Praise!  We cannot give too many details for privacy reasons, however, someone here in the Puget Sound Community, ex-Mormon, accepted the true Lord Jesus into “their” heart as Lord and Savior because of the debate!  All we can say is “Praise God!” 

We’ve been in touch several times with a very nice lady who listened to KGNW the Monday after the show (Thor actually had me do the program w/ him impromptu).  I was able to pray for a woman whose daughter is thinking of joining the Church.  Daughter’s name is Lauren, 18, freshman at University of Washington.  Lauren needs to be introduced to good Christian kids on campus. 

I (Michelle) received several e-mails from members of the Church who believe that I am totally wrong about my claims in regards to the lack of the cross and want for me to issue a public apology for my statements on KGNW.  My answer…no. 

Praise!  An ex-Mormon Christian listening to the debate wrote in to volunteer to help us at the ministry!

Praise!   We have a volunteer for translating our tracts from English into Spanish!  Because the Lord provided so quickly and abundantly on this I’m going to be confident in asking my next request!  If you speak a language other than English or Spanish and would like to see tracts printed in that language and would be willing to translate them for us, let us know!  

Praise!  We received many requests for mentoring packets.  The new outlines are going to print this week, if you’re interested in an expanded, updated version (80 pgs.), don’t forget to send an e-mail to michelle@lifeafter.org to let me know!  We’re requesting $3.00 for s+h for postage. 

Prayer and Praise!  A 40+ year old mentally disabled man contacted Life After about a week before the debate.  He was a convert in the LDS Church and was active for approximately seven years.  He felt the Lord tell him two months ago to leave the Church because they weren’t Christian.  Ironically enough, Michael, ended up attending my church.  He then was listening to the radio, heard the debate and called our ministry line.  To make things even more confusing for him, Mr. Burnham (from the debate) is Michael’s Stake President.  Various members of his ward are harassing him at the stores, etc., in the town they live.  I am confident you’ll know how to pray!  J   This isn’t the first time I’ve had to deal with the Church and mentally impaired members who want out. 

Jeff Burnham – Stake President at debate.

Doug Crandall – Jeff’s neighbor and fellow Mormon at debate. 

We thank each and every one of you for praying for us and the ministry.  We couldn’t do this without you!  May God bless you and our warmest greetings go out to you as you celebrate this upcoming Thanksgiving! 

With Love in Christ;

Michelle Grim

1 Cor. 1:18

www.lifeafter.org

Quote of the month from the Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pg. 156; “O ye Twelve! and all Saints! profit by this important Key—that in all your trials, troubles, temptations, afflictions, bonds, imprisonments and death, see to it, that you do not betray heaven; that you do not betray Jesus Christ; that you do not betray the brethren; that you do not betray the revelations of God, whether in Bible, Book of Mormon, or Doctrine and Covenants, or any other that ever was or ever will be given and revealed unto man in this world or that which is to come. Yea, in all your kicking and flounderings, see to it that you do not this thing, lest innocent blood be found upon your skirts, and you go down to hell. All other sins are not to be compared to sinning against the Holy Ghost, and proving a traitor to the brethren.

   

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Joseph Smith’s Character

Will the Real Joseph Smith Please Stand Up?

 By Mark Grote 2004

 Born on December 23, 1805, Joseph Smith could run faster, throw farther and jump higher than the other kids in Sharon, Vermont. If you tour the sites in Nauvoo, IL., the place of his death, that’s what you’ll hear of Joseph Smith as you move about the historical landmarks.

 But if you are interested in facts, instead of legends, you might find yourself questioning whether it’s a good idea to put your eternity in the hands and beliefs of this man.

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Oaths & Loyalty

      Loyalty can be a noble thing in life.  There are a number of causes we can be loyal to and as Christians we all know that the loyalty of Jesus’ love for us knows no bounds.  But what about mankind; where’s the line of being loyal and the line of blind obedience which can lead to destruction?

     My family and I watched a movie this past week about Dietrich Bonhoeffer.  He was a German pastor and theologian who helped secure freedom for Jews from 1939 to the time of his imprisonment in 1943. 

     The short film about Bonhoeffer, Agent of Grace, is just one of a handful of movies released about Hitler.   Each begs the question of what the difference is between loyalty and blind obedience.  How could something like the Holocaust happen and why didn’t anyone question their moral conscience when swearing allegiance to Hitler?  Every member of the German armed forces swore an oath of allegiance to Hitler.  Notice it wasn’t to the country or the constitution of Germany, but to Hitler.  They oath each member took is as follows:

 “The Wehrmacht Oath of Loyalty to Adolf Hitler, 2 August 1934

“I swear by God this sacred oath that I shall render unconditional obedience to Adolf Hitler, the Führer of the German Reich, supreme commander of the armed forces, and that I shall at all times be prepared, as a brave soldier, to give my life for this oath.”” (1)

      Compare the above information with the oaths of personal allegiance to the constitution of the United States that is taken by each member of the American Armed Forces:

 “I, (NAME), do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God.”  (2)

      As you can see, the evidence of where the loyalties of these two militaries lie is abundantly clear.  The American military vows to protect our land and Hitler demanded unfettered loyalty to him.  This is a classic example of how blind obedience leads to tragedy.

     Now while loyalty to your family or friends is commendable, we still have to ask; how far is too far?  Seeing the film on Bonhoeffer reminded me of the oaths Mormons will take each time they go to temple or even the oaths they take towards their own souls when “bearing their testimonies”.  As you well know the testimony of a Mormon is eerily similar to each other.  The same words and phrases are used to define their individual commitment and adoration towards the Church, Jesus, the Book of Mormon and lest we forget; Joseph Smith.

    Let me make something very clear before I proceed any further.  I do not believe that Mormons behave like Nazis.  I do not equate Hitler to any past, present or future prophet of the LDS Church.  The reason I use the analogy is to show how blind obedience to a person and/or system is a dangerous behavior.

     While some of the words a Mormon will use in their testimonies are in a different order, the main theme runs throughout each.  This is typically what you’ll hear;

 “I know the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is the only true Church on the face of the earth.  I know the Book of Mormon is the word of God.  I know that Joseph Smith was a true prophet of God and I know that the current president (right now it’s Monson) is a true prophet of God.  I know that Christ is the Messiah who died for me and was resurrected on the 3rd day…”

      On the LDS Church News website I found a section that gives instructions for members to teach their children how to “bear their testimonies”.  (3)  According to this site “testimony language is different from talking about God”.  Huh? 

     The site tells the reader they should teach children what to bear testimony of; Christ, Joseph and the Book of Mormon.  It then tells them to practice at home in informal settings.

     First of all, why would there be such a thing as “testimony language”?  Secondly, why should you be taught to “bear testimony of the Church, the prophet Joseph”, etc.?  A testimony is a declaration of your faith, or a statement you give while under oath in a court setting to tell what you know of a certain situation.  It’s a statement about something you know to be true in your personal experience.

     Thirdly, it says to tell the children that their testimonies will grow.  Isn’t this a given?  I mean why would you tell somebody what to say about the personal things they already know? Why is it they have to be dictated to regarding how they share their own experiences?  This is manipulative

     Kirk and I traveled extensively throughout Europe when we lived there in the mid eighties and I’ve often said the one place that reminded me most of Utah was East Berlin.  The tones of the people’s voices and the emptiness in their eyes spoke volumes to me.  It was obvious to all that the presence of communism had taken its toll.

     Throughout all our travels Kirk and I met a lot of people and ironically the one thing that attracted me to the Christians was their testimonies.  Each person had their unique story, but each fact they shared with me about Jesus was the same.  He loves me, He died for me and He was God incarnate.  Those were the only similarities existent in their “testimonies”.  No one practiced it before they met me and then recited something by rote, yet the vocabulary they spontaneously used radiated their devotion for Christ Jesus.

      The US military gathers their new recruits together and they pledge to obey so that the forces stay strong.  Hitler did this to another extreme to ensure that everyone did just as they were told at all times so that he could someday rule the world much like the Romans did.  What purpose does it serve for everyone to have similar testimonies, other than to control the masses?

     Can you just imagine what the Apostle Paul would’ve said?  How would he talk about Joseph Smith or the Book of Mormon?  What do you think his testimony is like up in heaven?  With the utter devotion he portrayed to Jesus in his writings, where would Joseph or Monson fit in?  If we’re so busy talking about Smith, Hinckley and/or Monson then honestly, where in your testimony does Jesus fit?

     To show what I mean about their devotion to Smith take a look at what it says in Joseph Smith:  The Choice Seer, Part III, Chapter 25;

 “The accumulation of all scholarly knowledge in the earth’s history of events past or the projection of things future will yet pale into embarrassed silence when compared with the knowledge granted us through the instrumentality of the Prophet Joseph Smith. Such things stand as a third great evidence of his prophetic calling.”

      Just think…even Moses and Isaiah, not to mention Jesus’ knowledge, will “pale in embarrassed silence” when compared to the third grade education of good ol’ Joe.  Now in light of this let’s see one of the reasons they say we should trust the prophet Joseph Smith.  Discourses of Wilford Woodruff, pg. 67;

 “GREATNESS OF JOSEPH SMITH. I look upon Joseph Smith as the greatest prophet that ever breathed the breath of life, excepting Jesus Christ. Father Adam, as I have said, stands at the head; but Joseph Smith was reserved to lay the foundation of this great kingdom and dispensation of salvation to the whole human family in these last days, to build up Zion, to establish God’s kingdom, and to prepare it for the coming of the Son of Man.”

      Again, unfettered loyalty to a man is a dangerous thing.  It has the potential of great destruction either to one person or a whole society.  Yet they have the examples listed above on where to direct their loyalty to and even receive other examples from the pulpits of their schools.  At Brigham Young University, the apostle Dallin Oaks said this at the CES Doctrine and Covenants Symposium;

 “Our individual, personal testimonies are based on the witness of the Spirit, not on any combination or accumulation of historical facts. If we are so grounded, no alteration of historical facts can shake our testimonies.” (“1985 CES Doctrine and Covenants Symposium,” Brigham Young University, Aug. 16, 1985, page 26)

      The point is this; on whom or what do you lay your devotion?  Making public oaths is a serious business and shouldn’t be taken lightly, yet this is what each and every Mormon does when they bear their testimonies to what they falsely believe is truth.  For the Mormon the oath is made to not only Joseph Smith, but to all prophets in the Church, the Book of Mormon and the Church itself.  Jesus ends up being a mere sideline attribute.  The pressure of believing all this is tremendous as they’re promised suffering for any incompliance.

     For example, there is a list of protocols called “The Fourteen Fundamentals of Following Our Prophets”.  The complete list will be posted at the end of this article but the last item is what caught my attention.  It says;

 “The prophet and the presidency—the living prophet and the First Presidency—follow them and be blessed—reject them and suffer.

    Now tell me how this is inspired?  Where in the Bible did Jesus ever tell us to follow mankind and manmade institutions in this manner?

     Pray with us won’t you?  Pray for each and every member of the LDS Church to indeed have a personal revelation and testimony as to the truth of this false church and the truth of the One True God, Christ Jesus.

 With Love in Christ;

Michelle …

 Jude 1:24-25; “Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy, 25 To the only wise God our Saviour, be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen.”

 1 – http://ddickerson.igc.org/oath-of-loyalty.html

2 – http://usmilitary.about.com/od/joiningthemilitary/a/oathofenlist.htm

3 – http://www.ldschurchnews.com/articles/24091/How-to-help-children-learn-to-properly-bear-their-testimonies.html

 Liahona June 1981, pg. 1, Ezra Taft Benson, “Fourteen Fundamentals in Following the Prophet

(Address given Tuesday, February 26, 1980 at Brigham Young University); “In conclusion let us summarize this grand key, these “Fourteen Fundamentals in Following the Prophet”, for our salvation depends on them.”

 1. The prophet is the only man who speaks for the Lord in everything.

2. The living prophet is more vital to us than the standard works.

3. The living prophet is more important to us than a dead prophet.

4. The prophet will never lead the church astray.

5. The prophet is not required to have any particular earthly training or credentials to speak on any subject or act on any matter at any time.

6. The prophet does not have to say “Thus Saith the Lord,” to give us scripture.

7. The prophet tells us what we need to know, not always what we want to know.

8. The prophet is not limited by men’s reasoning.

9. The prophet can receive revelation on any matter, temporal or spiritual.

10. The prophet may advise on civic matters.

11. The two groups who have the greatest difficulty in following the prophet are the proud who are learned and the proud who are rich.

12. The prophet will not necessarily be popular with the world or the worldly.

13. The prophet and his counselors make up the First Presidency—the highest quorum in the Church.

14. The prophet and the presidency—the living prophet and the First Presidency—follow them and be blessed—reject them and suffer.

I testify that these fourteen fundamentals in following the living prophet are true. If we want to know how well we stand with the Lord then let us ask ourselves how well we stand with His mortal captain—how close do our lives harmonize with the Lord’s anointed—the living Prophet—President of the Church, and with the Quorum of the First Presidency.

May God bless us all to look to the Prophet and the Presidency in the critical and crucial days ahead is my prayer.”

 

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Baptisms for the Dead

The following paragraph about the practice of baptizing the dead was taken from Jefflindsey.com, an LDS “apologetic” website–if there is such a thing.  It shows how Mormons helplessly try to explain the practice of baptizing the dead:

 “Baptism for the dead is a powerful evidence that Joseph Smith was a real prophet and the Church of Jesus Christ has been restored. The LDS practice has long been derided as absolute fiction and an abomination, and based on a terrible mis-interpretation of 1 Cor.15:29. However, long after Joseph Smith restored the practice through revelation, dozens of ancient documents have turned up showing that early Christians (at least some) indeed believed in and practiced baptism for the dead much as we do today. “

 I am always glad to see the appearance of the phrase “through revelation” because it usually means that all other Mormon explanations have been exhausted leaving only “we do what we want through revelation.”  

 If there’s a part of scripture that best illustrates how Mormons twist the word of God, this is it.  We have always maintained that Mormons are great basing an entire belief system upon one or two verses of scripture.  This is a well known fact amongst those of us who work in the field of counter-cult ministries.  The LDS Church is no exception to this rule, although they would vehemently deny the allegations.  There is literally one verse that talks about baptism for the dead and this is what the Mormon Church has put their minds on to set a standard of a dead work for their god.  It is found in 1 Corinthians 15:29 and it says; ‘Else what shall they do which are baptized for the dead, if the dead rise not at all? Why are they then baptized for the dead?’

 The key to understanding scripture is to read all things in context before you apply it to any teaching.  The first half of 1 Corinthians 15 is speaking about the absurdity of not believing in the resurrection of the dead.  Paul gave examples of those who had witnessed Jesus’ resurrection and then went on to explain that baptizing for dead people was even more absurd if they didn’t believe in the resurrection.  The uniqueness of Christianity lies in the resurrection of the dead.  For whatever reasons, the Corinthian church believed they needed to perform this proxy for the dead and Paul was there to set them straight.

 Joseph Smith is quoted in the book Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pg. 179 as follows; ‘The Saints have the privilege of being baptized for those of their relatives who are dead, whom they believe would have embraced the Gospel, if they had been privileged with hearing it, and who have received the Gospel in the spirit, through the instrumentality of those who have been commissioned to preach to them while in prison.’ 
 

Several questions arise in my mind when I read this thought process of Smith’s.  First of all, how does one know if their dead relative got the chance to hear the gospel in spirit prison?  Secondly, how could someone ever presume that their dead relative would even accept the gospel? Third, if, as many Mormon leaders teach today, that all people will be caught up in the first two levels of heaven regardless of whether they’re Mormon believer or not (i.e. they deny the concept of hell), then what is the point of baptizing the dead? Aren’t we all already going to heaven? 

Let’s look at the exact passage in scripture:

 1 Cor. 15: 29

 “Else what shall they do which are baptized for the dead, if the dead rise not at all? Why are they then baptized for the dead?” KJV.

Just to gather some meaning here, let’s read the same verse from the NLV to get a better understanding:

“What good will it do people if they are baptized for the dead? If the dead are not raised, why are people baptized for them?”

Mormon “apologists” put all their reasoning behind the word “they,” in 1 Cor. 15:29, as if to imply that since Paul said “they” in referring to his fellow apostles in the early part of the chapter, that he means to attribute “they” to [the apostles’] practices later in the chapter as well.

 We cannot build a doctrine based on that.  We need more.  We need to know what is biblical and what is not, based on the entire bible. Since God is not a God of confusion, He tells us what is His ways and what is not.  We know that when we see things mentioned in the bible, as in God’s law in the Old Testament, we also saw it in practice in the scriptures as well.  Paul talks about living a life for Christ numerous times in the New Testament and we see many characters in the Gospels doing just that. We also see what Paul wrote to the Churches in Ephesus, Corinth and others, yet again, we see it put into practice in Acts. We also know that the Church of Corinth was a church that was practicing some strange rituals.  They had lost their way and Paul’s letter was sent to correct that.  That alone should make us suspicious and cause us to question his motives for mentioning baptisms for the dead—if the context to the chapter were not obvious already.

 But let’s look at this from one other angle.  Doesn’t it seem reasonable that if baptisms for the dead were truly God’s way, then it’s a significant thing?  Forgetting or not baptizing the dead as the Mormon’s teach would cost someone their salvation, or so we’re led to believe by LDS doctrine.  That’s an incredible statement if true!  If it were a practice of the early church, and a teaching of Jesus Christ that Paul taught as well, shouldn’t it have appeared somewhere else in scripture?  Perhaps Paul just wasn’t that concerned about the dead. And perhaps Jesus had better things to do.

 Again, I cannot over emphasize this.  The idea of baptizing the dead so that people could be resurrected who would otherwise be lost for all eternity is a rather astonishing idea.  And there is much to be lost if the Church has failed to practice this exercise. Were it not the pagan ritual that it is, then we should have seen it put into practice by the early church. The book of Acts gave us many examples to follow, preaching, baptism, and laying on of hands, to name a few.

 I was baptized for the dead on several occasions in the Ogden Temple while I was growing up as a Mormon in Utah. I remember thinking I had never heard of any of the people I was baptized for so I was unable to say if those people accepted the gospel.  Each time I went to do my proxy work I wondered if what I was doing was in vain.  I prayed that with all my hard work to stay holy and pure to get in the temple wouldn’t be for nothing.  I wasted many hours praying they would accept what I had to offer them.

 The Lord tells us to set our minds upon the things of Christ.  In 2 Corinthians 10:5 it says; ‘Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ’.  The church keeps their members busy so they don’t have the time to think about the obedience of Christ, let alone anything He would want them to do, i.e., studying His Word.

 My prayer now is that if you are a Mormon, you will study the entire passage in 1 Corinthians 15 to see where this teaching originated.  I can assure you that it had nothing to do with the Mormon Jesus’ teaching on the ‘eternal principles’ of baptizing for the dead in the meridian of times and everything to do with Jesus’ resurrection as told consistently in other scriptures in the bible. Can Mormons present the same evidence for Baptism of the dead being taught elsewhere in scripture?

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Mormon Lifestyles & Daily Routines 

     The Mormon life is beset with many activities they see as necessary in their ultimate goal towards salvation.  Now while we can all be guilty of over scheduling our lives at times, we are assured by the Lord that we are never responsible for our own salvation – Ephesians 2:8-9 says; “For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.”   Good works are always a manifestation of our salvation; they never serve as a result of salvation.  They are faith in action; never because we must earn our own place beside Him.    Unfortunately for the Mormon this is not what they’ve been taught to believe.

(more…)

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Birth of Jesus; Purely Philosophical or Purely Divine?

 Christmas 2007

 Gal. 5:24; “And they that are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.”

      While doing some research for a project I came across the following statement made by the Prophet Brigham Young in Journal of Discourses 8:115-116;

 “While brother Joseph was referring to the providences of God, I was led to reflect that there is no act, no principle, no power belonging to the Deity that is not purely philosophical. The birth of the Saviour was as natural as are the births of our children; it was the result of natural action. He partook of flesh and blood—was begotten of his Father, as we were of our fathers.

      This quote was one of those that made me stop in my tracks.  How pathetically disgusting the thoughts was of this man to say such a thing!  I’ve always said that you can worship the rocks in your back yard and call them “god”, but that doesn’t make it any truer than calling my car “god”.

     Mankind has learned a lot about the Lord over the past 6,000 plus years, but that is only because God has revealed these things to us.  How could anyone believe the birth of Christ is purely philosophical?  We only know what we do about Him because of what He’s revealed to us and nothing more.  If His Son’s conception and birth could be found out through philosophical means, why pray tell are you worshipping a god that can only be as good as you are?

     I don’t know about the rest of you, but I can assure you that I am grateful I worship the Only God of the Universe.  I am assured success at the end of each day knowing that I can find comfort, rest, forgiveness and safety in His arms.  I can still have bad days here on earth, but one thing is certain – my concerns for tomorrow lay in His Sovereign Hands.

     Debasing the Father and Son brings no comfort to my soul.  I don’t find any peace in thinking that He had to make the same stupid mistakes I go through here on earth.  My question to those who believe this – how could you?

 Gal. 6:7; “Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.

         Here are the definitions of a few words taken from the American Heritage Dictionary and Random House Unabridged Dictionary at www.dictionary.com

 Philosophy – “Investigation of the nature, causes, or principles of reality, knowledge, or values, based on logical reasoning rather than empirical methods.

 Virgin – A person who has not experienced sexual intercourse

 Incest – “The crime of sexual intercourse, cohabitation, or marriage between persons within the degrees of consanguinity or affinity wherein marriage is legally forbidden.”

 * [see reference at end of article]

         Now read what the Apostle Orson Pratt had to say about the Heavenly Father and His daughter Mary:

 The Seer, pg. 158; The fleshly body of Jesus required a Mother as well as a Father.  Therefore, the Father and Mother of Jesus, according to the flesh, must have been associated together in the capacity of Husband and Wife; hence the Virgin Mary must have been, for the time being, the lawful wife of God the Father: we use the term lawful Wife, because it would be blasphemous  in the highest degree to say that He overshadowed her or begat the Savior unlawfully….But God having created all men and women had the most perfect right to do with His own creation, according  to His holy will and pleasure: He had a lawful right to overshadow the Virgin Mary in the capacity of a husband, and beget a Son, although she was espoused to another, for the law which He gave to govern men and women was not intended to govern Himself, or to prescribe rules for his own conduct.  ..Inasmuch as God was the first husband to her, it may be that He only gave her to be the wife of Joseph while in this mortal state, and that He intended after the resurrection to again take her as one of his own wives to raise up immortal spirits in eternity.

      Why would you want to believe in a god that is your “father” knowing that in heaven you’d be married to him for eternity?  As a female, the thought of sleeping with your father typically makes you shutter.  I can only imagine that any decent man would have the same reaction.

     I was a sixth generation Mormon from Utah and in the Church for thirty years.  For the last couple or so years of my Mormon life I began giving some serious attention and purposeful thoughts to the subject of “religion”.  I wasn’t so sure that I could stomach another religion per se; however I had a deep desire to read more about Jesus and find the truth.  There were just too many teachings in Mormonism that overshadowed the basics. 

     In those last couple of years before I accepted the truth, my heart began to panic when I thought of the implications.  I couldn’t stand the thought of being eternally pregnant and began telling God that I wanted to go to hell so I didn’t have to be married for eternity.  Then there were many times I’d have an overwhelming urge to sit and read the Gospels, knowing in my heart that I wanted to be in heaven someday.  As those times of study began more frequent, it occurred to me one day that I should probably read up on my Book of Mormon to see why I had such an aversion to it.  So I studied. 

     The truth is this:  no where in the Bible does it say that God had sex with Mary.  No where in the Bible does it say that Jesus was “the only begotten according to the flesh”; no where in the Bible does it say that Jesus was married.  The Bible doesn’t condone polygamy, nor does it intimate that God is an exalted man.  On the contrary the Word of God is consistently consistent!

     The entire Old Testament points to and prophecies about the coming Messiah.  I’ve never counted the number of verses in the Bible that describes God and/or Jesus.  I do know there are 333 prophecies in the Old Testament about Jesus Christ (all were fulfilled).  The point being I’d be here forever making sure I listed all of them.  For now, let’s take a look at just a handful of places we can “gain knowledge” about our God in order to worship Him the way we are meant to!  I’ve listed several scriptures identifying the reality about the God of the Universe and His Beloved Only Begotten Son, Jesus. 

     And please, if you’re LDS, pray about these and ask God to give you clarity of mind when you do. 

 With Love in Christ;

Michelle

Jude 24-25

 Hebrews 1:5;For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?

Is. 55:8-9;For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD. 9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.

 Ps. 111:2-4;The works of the LORD are great, sought out of all them that have pleasure therein. 3 His work is honourable and glorious: and his righteousness endureth for ever. 4 He hath made his wonderful works to be remembered: the LORD is gracious and full of compassion.

 Numbers 23:19;God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent: hath he said, and shall he not do it? Or hath he spoken, and shall he not make it good?

 Isaiah 7:14; Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel.

 Luke 1:31-35; “And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a son, and shalt call his name JESUS.  32 He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David:  33 And he shall reign over the house of Jacob for ever; and of his kingdom there shall be no end.  34 Then said Mary unto the angel, How shall this be, seeing I know not a man?  35 And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.

 Isaiah 9:6; For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

 Acts 3:15; And killed the Prince of life, whom God hath raised from the dead; whereof we are witnesses.

 Isaiah 46:4-5; And even to your old age I am he; and even to hoar hairs will I carry you: I have made, and I will bear; even I will carry, and will deliver you.  5 ¶ To whom will ye liken me, and make me equal, and compare me, that we may be like?

 Ex. 3:14; And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.

 John 8:58; Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.

 Isaiah 53:7; He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth.

 John 1:29; The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.

 Psalm 27:1; The LORD is my light and my salvation; whom shall I fear? The LORD is the strength of my life; of whom shall I be afraid?

 John 8:12; Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.

 Deut. 10:17; For the LORD your God is God of gods, and Lord of lords, a great God, a mighty, and a terrible, which regardeth not persons, nor taketh reward.

 1 Tim. 6:16; Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.

 Gal. 4:6; And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father.”

 Nahum 1:3-5; The LORD is slow to anger, and great in power, and will not at all acquit the wicked: the LORD hath his way in the whirlwind and in the storm, and the clouds are the dust of his feet.  4 He rebuketh the sea, and maketh it dry, and drieth up all the rivers…5 The mountains quake at him, and the hills melt, and the earth is burned at his presence, yea, the world, and all that dwell therein.

 Matthew 8:25-27; And his disciples came to him, and awoke him, saying, Lord, save us: we perish. 26 And he saith unto them, Why are ye fearful, O ye of little faith? Then he arose, and rebuked the winds and the sea; and there was a great calm.  27 But the men marvelled, saying, What manner of man is this, that even the winds and the sea obey him!

 Eph. 3:9; And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ.

      I pray that during this Christmas season the Mormon people will take more than just a few minutes to think about whom they are worshipping.  The Jesus of the Bible is not a created being, but in fact is the Creator; He is God Incarnate; Redeemer; Prince of Peace; Light of the world; Son of God; and last but not least;

 Jude 1:24-25; Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy, 25 To the only wise God our Saviour, be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen.

  * The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition
Copyright © 2006 by Houghton Mifflin Company.

 * Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.1)
Based on the Random House Unabridged Dictionary, © Random House, Inc. 2006.

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Studying the Book of Mormon 11

 “The measure of a man’s real character is what he would do if he knew he would never be found out.” – Lord Macaulay

 If I were to rank the books in the Book of Mormon on the level of the most nefarious and cockamamie stories, Ether would be at the very top of my list.  It’s obvious from Joseph Smith’s paper trail that nothing was left to the imagination of what kind of man he was.

 One of the main problems with this story is the timeline.  According to reputable historians, the confounding of languages at the Tower of Babel took place circa 3,300 BC and through the Peleg continental division in 3006 BC.  Ether supposedly took place in 2200 BC.

 A very reliable and well written site on the historical, archaeological and biblical findings of this event in history can be found here:

http://ldolphin.org/babel.html

 The book of Ether contains so many impossibilities, false prophecies, plagiarisms, contradictions and flat out lies that we’re just going to jump right into the list this week.

 If the book of Mormon is true, it’ll hold up to the scrutiny and prove itself to be from God.  Thus far, history has proven otherwise.  If you’re a member of the LDS Church, do this for yourself; actually study it and see if I’m wrong.  This isn’t a time for feelings – this is a time for truth.

 We learn from scripture when we should and shouldn’t judge.  I was reminded of this while doing some research for a friend about another subject matter.  We are not to judge motives which are hidden because only God knows our hearts.  According to Paul we are not to judge what others eat or drink because those things are between that person and God alone.  Romans 14:1-4.  We must, however, judge public teachings and commanded to do this as Paul advised Timothy in 1 Timothy 4:6.

 False prophets teach messages that come from themselves, not from God.  Jesus tells us in John chapter ten that He is the door and robbers never go through the door of Jesus.  They always try to hoist themselves up through another way, to trick the sheep with another teaching and another belief.  They always have a secret or exclusive doorway and teaching they’ve privately been shown by God.

 We are to defend the gospel that has been delivered once to the saints (Jude 1:3) and hate even the garment that’s been tarnished (Jude 1:23).

 Here’s what the LDS Church has to say about Mr. Smith’s teachings; as you can see, they obviously don’t have a problem with what he did or said.

 “As guided by the Spirit, Joseph spent about three years going through the Bible, making thousands of corrections to the text and restoring information that had been lost. This restored information sheds marvelous light on many doctrines that are not clearly presented in the Bible as it exists today.

 http://lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?hideNav=1&locale=0&sourceId=c5a720596a845110VgnVCM100000176f620a____&vgnextoid=da135f74db46c010VgnVCM1000004d82620aRCRD

 Noteworthy teachings

 Jared says you can read about Sodom and Gomorrah as well as Jericho in the Bible, why would the Mormons do this if the Bible is corrupt? – Ether 1:4

Everyone’s language confounded but Jared, his brother & friends – Ether 1:35-7

Jared and brother along with families and friends of friends and their families went to the valley to gather animals – Ether 2:1

Sailing crew commanded to go no further than America – Ether 2:7

Circa 2,200 BC even before there were Israelites, Gentiles told to repent – Ether 2:11

God leaves when you sin – Ether 2:15

God forgot they needed air in the barge so Jared instructs God on how to build a seafaring vessel – Ether 2:16

Barge built tight just like a dish – Ether 2:17

Built the boat so they wouldn’t drown in the flood – ??? – Ether 2:20

Brother of Jared saw the finger of Jesus and was afraid Jesus would smite him because he found out God has flesh and bones – Ether 3:8

No one has greater faith than brother of Jared – Ether 3:9

There are a couple of problems with the verse listed below.

 Ether 3:13; “And when he had said these words, behold, the Lord showed himself unto him, and said: Because thou knowest these things ye are redeemed from the fall; therefore ye are brought back into my presence; therefore I show myself unto you.

 This story contradicts the Bible – no man has seen God.  Exodus 33:20

Knowing something doesn’t bring salvation – Eph. 2:8-9

 How can God be the father and the son? – Ether 3:14

VERY confusing verse –

 Ether 3:19;And because of the knowledge of this man he could not be kept from beholding within the veil; and he saw the finger of Jesus, which, when he saw, he fell with fear; for he knew that it was the finger of the Lord; and he had faith no longer, for he knew, nothing doubting.

 Why would God do this?  Only priests were allowed behind the veil.  What’s the deal with the faith statement?

Brother of Jared has perfect knowledge of God – Ether 3:20

Another VERY confusing verse –

 Ether 3:22;And behold, when ye shall come unto me, ye shall write them and shall seal them up, that no one can interpret them; for ye shall write them in a language that they cannot be read.

 Again, why would God do something like this?  Why would he have something written in a language no one could understand?

Jesus shows the nameless brother of Jared every single person on earth that had lived before him and even those who will ever live on the face of the earth after him – Ether 3:25

God can’t withhold anything – Ether 3:26

Textual change – Mosiah was Benjamin in 1830 version – Ether 4:1

Moroni seals up the interpreters – Ether 4:5

Jesus curses anyone that doesn’t believe the Book of Mormon – Ether 4:8

Either God is talking about his father in heaven or Jesus is his own dad – Ether 4:12

Circa 2,200 BC, before there were Israelites, Jesus calls upon the Gentiles to believe – Ether 4:13

Only 3 uneducated men will know how to translate plates – Ether 5:2-4

Was Orihah a polygamist?  He had 31 kids – Ether 7:2

Story of John the Baptist lifted with name changes – Ether 8:4

Why were these Jewish people eating pork? – Ether 9:18

Lots of big cities…no archaeological evidence – Ether 9:23

Many serpents poison lots of people – Ether 9:31

Poisonous serpents chase people – Ether 9:33

Oaths are bad – Ether 10:33

They rejected the prophets because of their secret societies (Mormons come to mind…) – Ether 11:22

In 2200 BC the Spirit of the Lord was inside of Ether – Ether 12:2

Christ showed himself after his resurrection to the fathers of Jaredites (remember this was written in 2200 BC) – Ether 12:7

By faith the Law of Moses was given – Ether 12:11

By faith the 3 disciples didn’t die – Ether 12:17

Many people saw beyond the veil because of faith – Ether 12:19

God can’t hide his finger from the brother of Jared – Ether 12:20

New Jerusalem in America – Ether 13:4

Wanted to write more but was forbidden – Ether 13:13

The curse of the vanishing tools – Ether 14:1

Fighting for the defense of his property and wives – Ether 14:2

One of the secret combinations murdered a high priest – Ether 14:10

Coriantumr invites Shiz to battle – Ether 14:28

2 million people died in war (this is 5x the number of Americans killed in WW2) – Ether 15:2

Headless Shiz rises up on his arms and breathes – Ether 15:31

 Things not invented yet OR not in America at that time

 Aquariums – Ether 2:2

Bees – Ether 2:3

Glass – Ether 2:23

Flocks & herds – Ether 6:4

Steel – Ether 7:9

Silks, grains – Ether 9:17-19

Flocks – Ether 9:31

Grains, flocks, gold – Ether 10:12, 23, 24

 Greek & Latin words found (small list) in BC era

 Apostles – Ether 12:41

Baptize – 4:18 (2x), 12:14

Christ – 4:1, 2, 3; 12:7, 16, 19, 38; 13:4

Cross – 2:6, 22, 25; 3:3, 4; 4:1; 6:3; 8:9

Disciples – 4:10; 12:17, 31

Epistle – 15:4, 5 (2x), 18

Exceedingly – This word was used 40 times in 15 chapters

 2:17

3:1, 9

6:28

7:1, 4, 7, 11, 19

8:5, 7, 8, 9

9:15, 16 (3x), 23, 26, 30

10:3, 4, 6, 9, 12, 13, 22, 27

11:4

12:19

13:27 (2x)

14:4, 16, 29

15:8, 9, 16

Gentile – God had not formed the nation of Israel at this point in history, but Ether seems to have already separated the people and made reference to Gentiles 10 times.

 2:11

4:6, 13

12:22, 23, 25, 28, 35, 36, 38

Gospel – 4:3, 18

Grace – 12:26, 27, 36, 41

Holy Ghost – 5:4; 12:14, 23, 41

Jesus – 3:17, 19, 20; 5:5; 12:39, 41

Jesus Christ – 2:12; 3:14, 19, 20; 4:7, 8; 12:22, 41

John – 4:16

Saint – 8:22

Son of God & variations – 4:7; 9:22; 12:18

 Use of the phrase “and it came to pass”

Ether has 433 verses and this phrase showed up 167 times in 156 of the verses.  That means 35% of the text contains this phrase.  Questions for the Mormon: how does this glorify God and how did this phrase add to the storyline of the text?

 1:35. 37, 38, 39, 40 – 5 verses

2:1, 4, 5 (2x), 6, 13, 14, 16, 18, 21 – 10x, 9 verses

3:1, 6, 21, 28 – 4 verses

6:2, 4 (2x), 5, 6, 7, 8, 13, 18, 21, 22, 25 (2x), 26, 27, 29, 30 – 17x, 15 verses

7:1, 3 (2x), 5, 7, 8, 11, 12, 14, 15, 17, 18, 24 (2x), 26 – 15x, 13 verses

8:1, 2, 4, 5, 6 (2x), 9, 11, 13, 14, 15, 18, 25 – 13x, 12 verses

9:1, 4, 5, 7, 9, 10, 14, 15, 23 (2x), 24 (2x), 25, 27, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 – 21x, 19 verses

10:1, 2, 4, 5, 7, 9, 12, 13, 15, 17, 18, 19, 29, 30, 32 – 15 verses

11:2, 5, 7, 9, 10, 12, 13, 14 (2x), 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 23 – 15x, 14 verses

12:1, 5, 36, 37 – 4 verses

13:15, 18, 19, 22, 23, 27, 28 (2x), 29 – 9x, 8 verses

14:4, 5, 7, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 17, 19, 26, 29 (2x), 30 – 16x, 15 verses

15:1, 4, 5, 6, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 15, 16, 17, 18, 20, 24, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32 – 23 verses

 Poor grammar

 Ether 3:2; “…and that we are unworthy before thee; because of the fall our natures have become evil continually…”

Ether 7:16; “And he gave battle unto Shule, the king…”

Ether 7:17; “And it came to pass that he gave battle again unto Shule, the king…”

Ether 7:19; “…nevertheless they did not gain power any more over Shule the king…”

Ether 7:21; “And Cohor, the son of Noah, caused that his people should give battle unto Shule…”

8:3; “And when he had gained the half of the kingdom he gave battle unto his father…”

Ether 8:5; “…they did raise an army and gave battle unto Jared.  And it came to pass that they did give battle unto him by night.”

Ether 8:8; “…daughter of Jared being exceedingly expert…”

Ether 10:9; “…Morianton, (he being a descendant of Riplakish) gathered together an army of outcasts, and went forth and gave battle unto the people…”

Ether 10:27; “…they did work all manner of work of exceedingly curious workmanship.”

Ether 10:34; “Now Com did fight against them much….”

Ether 11:15; “…and there arose a mighty man among them in iniquity, and gave battle unto Moron…”

Ether 12:6; “And now, I, Moroni, would speak somewhat concerning these things…”

Ether 13:16; “…wherefore he gave battle unto them who sought to destroy him”

Ether 13:23; “…Shared, and he also gave battle unto Coriantumr; and he did beat him, insomuch that in the third year he did bring him into captivity.”

Ether 13:29; “…Shared gave him battle again upon the plains…”

Ether 13:30; “…Coriantumr gave Shared battle again…”

Ether 14:3; “…the brother of Shared and he gave battle unto Coriantumr…”

Ether 14:4 “…the brother of Shared did give battle unto him in the wilderness of Akish…”

Ether 14:7; “…which he did receive great strength to his army.”

Ether 14:8; “…Gilead, also received great strength to his army, because of secret combinations.”

Ether 14:10; “And it came to pass that one of the secret combinations murdered him in a secret pass…”

Ether 14:11; “…Coriantumr came up unto the land of Moron, and gave battle unto Lib…”

Ether 14:12; “And it came to pass that he fought with Lib, in which Lib did smite upon his arm that he was wounded…”

Ether 14:13; “…and Lib gave battle unto him upon the seashore.”

Ether 14:16; “And when he had come to the plains of Agosh he gave battle unto Lib, and he smote upon him until he died…”

Ether 14:26; “…and there he gave battle unto Shiz for the space of three days”

Ether 15:2; “He saw that there had been slain by the sword already nearly two millions of his people…”

Ether 15:6; “…the people of Shiz did give battle unto the people of Coriantumr.”

Ether 15:16; “…so great were their cries, their howlings and lamentations, that they did rend the air exceedingly.”

Ether 15:17; “…they did rend the air with their cries, and their howlings, and their mournings, for the loss of the slain of their people.”

 False prophecies

Intro for Ether – God didn’t confound their language (Gen. 11:9)

Ether 1:35 – God didn’t confound their language (Gen. 11:9)

Ether 1:43 – This is a false prophecy. These folks were destroyed.

Ether 3:9-17 – Because of faith of Jared’s brother, God will become man & he showed himself unto the brother of Jared

Ether 4:6 – Gospel not given to Gentiles until they repent

Ether 4:15 – Those who don’t believe Book of Mormon are not saved

 Ether 6:11; “And thus they were driven forth, three hundred and forty and four days upon the water.

 I have a few questions about the verse above.  According to the website of Port World, sailing from Kuwait to Los Angeles is 11,551 miles.  Sailing along at 4 knots would take 121 days.  http://www.portworld.com/map

Most ships at the time of the Greco-Roman Empire could sail from 50-60 miles per day with 170 oarsmen.  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trireme

 How many people were on that ship and why didn’t God know how to build the barge with the amount of people needed to properly navigate it?  Why did it take them 3 times longer than it should have?

 Ether 12:11 – By faith the Law of Moses was given and the Son came because of faith.  Jesus came to pay the price for sin, not because people had faith.

Ether 12:19 – by faith the ancient fathers saw behind the veil

Ether 15:19 – Spirit of the Lord went away because of sin (the Bible tells us He will never leave once He comes to us in John 14:16-17)

 Plagiarism

 Ether 4:18-19 – See Acts 2:38, Mark 16:16-17; Matthew 25:34

 Ether 8:10, 25 – See Matthew 14:6-11; John 8:44; 2 Cor. 11:3

 Ether 12:4, 6, 8, 11, 17, 19, 22, 26, 28, 32-35, 37, 41 – See Heb. 6:19; 2 Cor. 9:8; Heb. 11:1 (Compare rest of this passage with all of Hebrews 11 – “The Hall of Faith”; Hebrews 6:4, 2 Cor. 12:31; Heb. 11:30, Heb. 11:5, 6:19, 11:33, 2 Cor. 12:9; 1 Cor. 13:13; John 14:2, 10:17; Matt. 25:28-29; 2 Cor. 13:14

 Ether 13:9-10, 12 – See Rev. 21:1; 2 Cor. 5:17; Rev. 21:2, 7:14; Matt. 19:30

 Greatness of America

 America is great –

1:42, 43

2:7, 9, 10, 12, 15

 America is the Promised Land –

2:7, 8, 9

6:5, 8, 12, 16

7:27

 America is choice above all other lands –

2:7, 10, 12, 15

9:20

10:28

13:2

 New Jerusalem in America –

3:3, 4, 5, 6, 10

 America is land of inheritance –

13:8

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Islam vs Mormonism

 by Kirk Grim

                The Islamic faith is centered on the belief in one God and in Arabic he is called Allah. The Muslims, followers of Islam, believe that Muhammad was visited by an angel of light from whom he received God’s final revelation. Muhammad claimed that this angel of light was Gabriel, the same Gabriel as the one from the Old Testament of the Bible. It was several years before these visions were recorded in what is called the Quran, the sacred scripture of Islam.

(more…)

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